Re: [wmii] Re: layout per tag.

From: Stefan Tibus <>
Date: Tue, 15 Aug 2006 10:32:19 +0200

On Mon, 14 Aug 2006 17:54:57 +0200 Denis Grelich <> wrote:
> On Mon, 14 Aug 2006 15:41:31 +0200 "Stefan Tibus" <> wrote:
> > First of all, there is some personal taste involved, which no
> > wm will ever be able to guess.
> Personal taste comes only into play when you select your tool. You
> can't configure that much on a screwdriver or a hammer. Neither on a
> car. Yet your taste is very important when you choose if you either
> want a screwdriver with a big, round handle or small one of plastic, or
> if you buy a VW Polo or a Mercedes.
> Now think about it for a second. How many super-customizable tools with
> exchangeable handles and stuff did you throw away already or did you
> put away on the shelf because they're all crappy and flaky? Good tools
> are simple tools.
Ok. How many screw drivers do you know that try to guess
where you want to put your next screw themselves?
That's the main point, why something like wmii will need
customization. Because it tries to arrange the windows
automatically for the user. But what is good for the user?
There's also taste and habits involved. Other wm's leave this
completely to the user or are somewhat dynamic but stick
to fixed layouts more or less. wmii tries to be better in not
imposing fixed layouts. It is good. But often enough the result
is just not want. (I surely prefer fixed layouts on views for
repeating or fixed tasks. Yet I like dynamic layouts for other
tasks. - I need a good mixture of both.)

> Honestly, are there any applications that you use every day that
> you /really/ like? I, honestly, didn't find a good MUA, or a usable
> Browser or even text editor yet. I suppose they have to be written from
> scratch anyway. Hopefully,the 10kloc project will provide us with
> those ;)
I'm waiting for those since 15 years or more. Do you really expect
them to emerge within the next two years or so? And what should I
do in the meantime? - That's just no answer you provided here.
> And besides, 90% of your programs are OSS anyway. So what's the problem?
I have other things to do than write my every-day use software
myself. I'm no programmer, I'm a user.

> > (and the hints provided by the programmer may still not result in
> > what the user wants)
> Again, a good craftsman learns to use his tools well, not the other way
> round. A tool is by definition /not/ smart, it mustn't try to adapt
> to the user. It is very simple to adapt to a tool though. And if
> the program does not fit your needs, it's simply the wrong one.
Hm. Seems most programmers aren't good craftsmen then...
And then, wmii definitely tries to be smart regarding the dynamic
window arrangement - so it's no tool according to your definition?

> > The only way to account for different personal taste is
> > customizability... (and I don't mean by modifying the source
> > code).
> Yeah, customizability, like in choosing the colour of your car or
> putting in other foot mats.
That's not what I meant. Using your car metaphor, wmii tries to be
a car with new steering controls and automated driving. But driving
styles can be very different and it will need customization options
in order to fit these. It's just not taking the same way through
the city centre I'd choose, because it doesn't now my hometown as
well as I do and I can't feed in the roadmap... ;-)


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Received on Tue Aug 15 2006 - 10:32:49 UTC

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